Warner Bros. has pushed the release date of the Wachowski’s Jupiter Ascending from July 18th of this year all the way to February 6th, 2015. Word is that the film needs more effects work. Within minutes the internet was throwing up its collective hands and chanting, “Game over, man! Game over!” eager to write it off and proclaim, “Disaster!”
Yes, it’s late in the game to notice the special effects could be improved but if improvements can indeed be made then I’m all for waiting a few months to give Lana and Andy Wachowski time to get it right. If the movie isn’t where it needs to be then I don’t need to see it yet. People make funny faces at February release dates, but a February release for Shutter Island was the slot where Scorsese scored his biggest opening ever and that film went on to bank $300 million worldwide. In fact Shutter Island earned more domestically than The Wolf of Wall Street, so laugh at Paramount’s decision all you want — it was a smart move. This year The LEGO Movie opened on the embarrassing date of Feb 7th and, hahaha, it only earned $462 million so far, hahaha. What a disaster!
This summer has been weak at the box-office and packed slates are brutal on tent poles that rely on opening weekend numbers to live or die. Last month was the slowest May at the multiplex since 2010. The July 18 premiere would have sandwiched Jupiter Ascending exactly halfway between Dawn of the Planet of the Apes and Guardians of the Galaxy and put Jupiter nose to nose with Hercules. Everyone likes a good circle jerk but I can’t blame Warners and the Wachowskis for wanting a little extra elbow room and more than one weekend to shoot their wad.
Meanwhile, I love watching everybody panic and throw Jupiter Ascending under the bus. I remember the very same jackals howling when Gravity was pushed back 11 months from it’s original November 2012 slot to October 2013.
Here’s an actual comment from the archives, May 15, 2012.
If this movie has been pushed out of 2012 then the studio doesn’t think it’s award-worthy and they want to throw it out there where no one will notice. One good thing is, this version probably didn’t cost the $80M the original was budgeted at. Bullock’s salary is no where near Angelina so that probably saved $15M and Robert Downey dropped out so that saved another $15. So, I think the studio is willing to let this thing die quietly. Personally, I think it sounded pretty awful from the beginning. No wonder Angelina chose “Maleficent” over this thing.
That’s right, geniuses. Keep cackling.
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Sometimes a February release date for a film is a breath of fresh air, and they can gain from all the hoopla awards movies released in December and still playing during awards season.
People go to the movies to catch the awards contenders, and just may be further tempted to see the new releases (via promos, ads, etc.).
I don’t think it is the “kiss of death” that a February release used to be.
And I like the example given about “Shutter Island”, a terrific film in my opinion. I agree with Ryan about its place in Scorsese’s canon of great films. “Shutter Island” that really resonates with repeated viewings, and is the first movie starring Leonardo DiCaprio where I respected his craft. His performance was heart-breaking.
Chris, I sort of assumed that “among big-ass blockbusters” was implied, but should have been clearer. GUARDIANS I’m super, excited about just not as much as I was about the JUPITER/APES combo.
Don’t overlook THE SIGNAL!
SNOWPIERCER was bomb.
Perhaps I’m just confused by that sentence. IDK.
“Warner Brothers didnt get behind it enough and stumbled into the comments by a…Ryan Adams”
Mik, wait…What??
Bryce, those are the only 2 movies for the rest of this summer you were looking forward to?
What about:
Boyhood
The Rover
Snowpiercer
Calvary
The Trip To Italy
Magic In The Moonlight
Guardians Of The Galaxy
“Thats the one reason I don’t complain about the likes of Transformers making ridiculous box office, because it allows studios to take risks on artistically creative films knowing that if they flop”
Mik, I agree and I don’t. While I know there are studios that milk the fuck out of franchises there are exceptions. I read somewhere that Peter Berg made Battleship for the sole reason he could make Lone Survivor, which I guess was a deal made with the studio. If that’s what it takes for some filmmakers to make their passion projects, bring on the crap and I’ll just skip seeing it.
Small world. As a result of this discussion I was just reading an article on The Guardian about how Cloud Atlas was marketed and released poorly and how Warner Brothers didnt get behind it enough and stumbled into the comments by a…Ryan Adams sharing my views on there just the same as he is sharing my views on here. Hypertextual.
“Here’s frankly what I think. Frankly I think we should step back and let directors make whatever kinds of movies they want to make and stop worrying about whether any of the rich dudes at the top are getting any fucking richer.”
Very much so. The only reason that I care about whether films make money or not, is because it makes them more likely to continue making films like that. Thats the one reason I don’t complain about the likes of Transformers making ridiculous box office, because it allows studios to take risks on artistically creative films knowing that if they flop, they’ve got it covered. I’m much more interested in seeing films I like than seeing films make their money back, thats the studio’s concern…not mine. I don’t see why people not involved in the industry are so obsessed with it.
Lea Seydoux is so beautiful she can say what she likes. And can never be sued. End of story. 🙂
I guess the question is, HAD Abdellatif Kechiche released Blue Is the Warmest Color earlier to contend for the Oscar, would it have even been nominated in the Best Foreign Language Film category?, and furthermore, would it have beaten The Great Beauty?
“but I think saying the film should not be released because it was “sullied” or threatening to sue Lea Seydoux for her remarks”
JamDenTel
That’s not what I was talking about at all. I’m sure the other producers and those who financed the film rolled their eyes at the suggestion that Kechiche could somehow take possession the movie and stuff it in the bottom drawer of his desk so that nobody could ever see it.
I brought up the case of Blue is the Warmest Color because for a few days everybody on the internet was in a tizzy because it was clear that the distributor had no intention of releasing the film 2 weeks sooner than its actual release date — so that meant it would not even be eligible for Oscar consideration, and all Kechiche did was shrug, because he’s not worried about an Oscar, he’s got a Palme d’Or.
The release date for Blue is the Warmest color totally blew off the Oscar deadlines so that it could land in French theaters at the optimal time to Make MONEY. That’s the connection to Jupiter Rising and Shutter Island. Producers and Distributors and Financiers are way more interested in making MONEY than they are in Oscars — unless they think an Oscar can help them achieve one thing: Making MONEY.
I only mentioned awards narratives because I was trying to explain how the Gravity shift (“gravity shift”…sounds like a natural disaster) wasn’t a major red flag for that film, because it was still getting a good release date. And I’ll grant that February isn’t the wasteland it used to be, but it’s still not July.
Indeed, there may be some prudence in the move. I saw the trailer again today (amusingly prefaced by an intro from Tatum and Kunis saying “we’ll see you this summer at the movies”) and I do think it looks promising, though not without some possible pitfalls–but that’s a matter for another discussion. I have every intention of seeing it in February, but the move does concern me a little.
As for Kechiche, some dickishness (or hardassery, if you prefer) IS probably necessary to thrive in the entertainment industry, but I think saying the film should not be released because it was “sullied” or threatening to sue Lea Seydoux for her remarks is pretty unacceptable behavior. But that’s just me.
Thanks for corrections, Ryan, and not at all. I knew you were just playing, I just used your quote as launchpad to elaborate on my actual fears of WB growing anxious about the bees and Redmayne’s dripping bod — and like similar with the NOAH studio, they could possibly like to see a version with as little of the crazy-colorfulness as possible. Unless officially contradicted, for now, I choose to believe the Wachowskis went a little “eh we could use more time with this”, and WB replied “you, fine folks, read our minds”
Has anyone watched the “making-of” documentary of Avatar?
In the documentary, it is revealed that Cameron and his crew kept “just barely” making the time expectations at each new step of the process. It’s practially a miracle that movie was released on time.
Just thought I would add this note to this discussion.
Shutter Island moved from October 2009 to February 2010, I still really liked it.
The Monuments Men moved from December 2013 to February 2014. I still really liked it.
Were either of these two movies gonna get a ton of Oscar nominations had they stayed in their previous release dates?? Probably not. But Oscars or not, they were still enjoyable. Hard to say if they had time to improve.
Foxcatcher moved from December 2013 to November 2014. I have a very good feeling about this movie, in both Oscar terms, and in (how much I like it) terms.
Jupiter Ascending moves from July 2014 to February 2015. I think either way I will enjoy it, as long as it’s not similar to Cloud Atlas. (I liked Cloud Atlas, but not a movie I’d want to see again.)
Then I guess I have no clue why you bring up awards narrative.
I agree with you: Gravity and Jupiter Ascending are not apparently the same movie. I cited Gravity because they took an entire extra year to polish the VFX on Gravity. That’s the similarity. October has nothing to do with it.
Gosh, Kechiche behaves dickishly so we should therefore assume he has no business savvy worth mentioning? Seems to be a gap in logic there. I’d say dickishness is sort of a business savvy prerequisite.
“Jupiter Ascending is not an Oscar movie. In no way shape or form. Why does it need to conform to awards narrative scheduling?”
I wasn’t saying it was trying to be. I was just saying the Gravity push and this push are not really that equivalent.
“Notice how much Abdellatif Kechiche did not give a fraction of a fuck about qualifying for Oscar consideration for Blue Is the Warmest Color.”
Well, I wouldn’t cite Kechiche myself, mostly because A. I found his post-Cannes behavior to be extremely unprofessional and B. I thought BitWC was seriously flawed.
And if this report is to be believed they were still shooting stuff a few weeks ago.
I believe the VFX reason but I think there’s probably more to it. I think nobody at WB wants to risk getting clobbered in a crowded month of tentpoles but they thought, ok that’s true but what else can we say that also true.
So here’s hoping they get to keep the hair, the ears, and the awesome outfits.
well, yes, I was kidding around about using VFX to remove some of Channing’s clothing. I thought I’d try to lighten my mood and stop sounding so defensive about this announcement but it was a weak joke, sorry.
[typos, Bryce? I think there were only 5 keystrokes to fix. I’ve got your back. You know I owe you.]
All told, Warners has probably earned over 3 billion dollars off The Matrix trilogy and it will continue to generate income for years to come. That kind of money buys a lot of lenient good will from a smart studio.
It doesn’t look like an Oscar movie, it also doesn’t look like a very good one either….
^^^Hiyooo!
Kane, ditto also about their visual “uniqueness”. Say what you will about SPEED RACER, but in the big screen, it’ll at least make you dizzy :p
But hey, now the Wachowskis join fellow losers Michael Mann and Chris Hemsworth as early risers in 2015. Not shabby company. I’ll join them if they’ll have me.
@Ryan: What I said about Shutter Island is my opinion. Feel free to disagree with it as much as you want. I still stand by it.
Bryce, I agree with you about their budgeting. It is fascinating they can achieve what they can with the amount of money they have.
I’m so sorry, Ryan! First time I’ve ever made that mistake in thinking it was Sasha’s piece and not yours 🙁 …then again I literally woke up, grabbed my phone and went to this article. Shows my priorities at least!
I think people are willing to declare it a failure BECAUSE the trailer was released and people have seen it. If all we had to go off of was a small description and the cast and then people said it’d fail, I’d disagree and say wait. Knowing the Wachowski’s made this though, that would give me a bit more pause. They’ve been more hit than miss. But after the trailer I lost any hope it would be a good movie. I’ll still watch it because I’m sure it’ll be (in it’s own way) visually unique but I’d wait until it’s available to rent unless I am hearing good things about it. I do get miffed at trolls and haters on the web oftentimes, which is why I go to only a handful of sites…including this lovely bastion of film geekery 🙂
“Are these people who are saying “game over man!” intellectuals and bloggers, critics, dear readers of yours or other sites who know what they’re talking about?”
The usual suspects, on one side, a barrage of Marvel-obsessed fanboy bloggers, on the other, our esteemed “box-office experts”. Both of this groups can make A LOT of noise I suppose. Both are simple-minded enough as to expect them not to like the movie very much.
Anyways. From a selfish point of view this is really disappointing for me. Along with APES it was the only movie I was truly stoked about out of what’s left of summer 2014. So that’s a bummer.
Like Ryan I want to be optimistic and believe this is nothing more than an unfinished-vfx situation. The bulk of photography only ended in August-September of last year so it’s not out of this realm that indeed they misjudged the time-frame for post-production. I can see them a month ago still confident that they would be done in time. Knowing the Wachowskis as the visual virtuosos that they are, you can deduce their post has to take them longer than average. And if this report is to be believed they were still shooting stuff a few weeks ago.
https://www.euroweeklynews.com/news/spanish-news/item/120464-wachowski-siblings-in-bilbao
Also doesn’t sound like re-shoots to me but just additional material they needed all along. Nobody is going to fail to mention Tatum, Kunis or any other star name had they in fact been around (you know, for traffic). Now the thing is, for all the technical excellence and scope of CLOUD ATLAS, that movie -as it is now- could easily cost $250M under any other filmmakers and still look like shit — the only reason it doesn’t, and that that was achieved for a meager $102M, is because these people take great care and put in the hours which make all the difference. Yes, they take an auteur approach to blockbusters which means closely supervising VFX, which in turn, makes their post take significantly longer. I guess the ‘6 weeks before’ sounds proper scandalous…to some. But if you also add the fact that the movie will probably recuperate more of its investment in February than it would in the summer, I can see WB feeling perfectly comfortable giving the filmmakers as much time as they needed. I doubt JUPITER ASCENDING does significant money, say north of double it’s budget, but I’m sure WB knew that green-lighting it. I mean they’ve now handled SPEED RACER *and* CLOUD ATLAS.
Now, the worst case scenario would be that the front and center of the Wachowski’s pitch for this movie was “THIS TIME WE’RE MAKING MONEY, WE SWEAR!”. I highly doubt it since they seem so out of touch with that aspect of the industry that they honestly don’t give a shit. But I guess for arguments’ sake you have to consider the possibility — in which case WB’s big honchos must have just seen in the last week the Wachowskis’ final cut, and it freaked the fuck out of them, and indeed they went, “you promised us money and ain’t no way this shit is making any!” which is the version being passed around. Call me naïve but I don’t think so.
“I’d be glad to hear that additional special effects were needed to fix Channing Tatum’s hair and ears back to normal and to digitally remove all those shirts that some crazy costume person put on him.”
It would be my worst nightmare. Sadly if there’s anything I can see them compromising on this, you know, toning down their eccentricities. I love how Tatum looks in the trailers, and especially in some poster that was released some time ago. Channing Tatum + Blonde = FUCK YES. I’m so glad whoever said no isn’t in charge of these decisions, because what would have been of poor BLADE RUNNER? Every movie would be “a Miramax” under the “serious/prestige/head in their ass/head way in the box” crowd. So here’s hoping they get to keep the hair, the ears, and the awesome outfits.
In a year with plenty of American masterpieces, 1999, the Wachowskis made what remains for me the best of the lot; one of the most influential films of the last 30 years period. Aside from THE MATRIX REVOLUTIONS I have -at least- liked everything else they have done — but my excitement for JUPITER ASCENDING rests exclusively in their last two features. I loved, loved, loved SPEED RACER and CLOUD ATLAS. Time will treat both of those films in much nobler fashion than their contemporaries did. SPEED RACER’s path to re-evaluation should be longer and harsher, but I’ve been observing all the right signals for a couple of years now.
I’m sure there’re typos. Sigh.
@Ryan
Yes, I noticed I strayed a bit from what you were saying in response to “awards narrative”. But you bring up a movie like Blue Is The Warmest Color and not expect me to digress? You can suck Abdellatif’s dick if you want, I mean, as a director, of that movie – he is brilliant. Do I want him as a camp leader. Nah, I’m good thanks.
I too at the end of the day don’t fall apart if movies I like don’t do well with awards. Or the Academy mostly. But I do get mad. Going to digress again and say Inception did not fit the “awards narrative” either. But I doubt Christopher Nolan gives a fuck. Though the Best Director omission was hard to take for me, as a fan.
I love the whole awards thing. of course we do. Look where we are. But, like you say, no golden prize will ever stop me watching and talking and thinking and dreaming about the movies we love. Never.
m1, if you want to argue with somebody about whether on not Shutter Island was garbage you can go yell at Roger Ebert in his grave and nag his beloved spirit about the 3 1/2 stars he gave it.
I’m typing all this on 5-inch phone screen and it’s giving me a headache to explain how different movies appeal to different people and how I’m perfectly ok with that.
I love the Wachowskis, the chances they take, their refusal to be pigeonholed in a genre that thrives on that, and I’m happy to wait for when THEY think their movie is ready to be seen.
Yes, I noticed that, Robin. A lot of what I saw Kechiche say and do was bewildering and a lot of it was despicable. However, what i saw him do with what was seen onscreen was spectacular.
But all of that has very little to do with what I’m talking about: movies and moviemakers shouldn’t have to cater to “awards narratives”
Once in a while I guess I just have to say it point blank without stuttering: I do not give a fuck about what little trophies get awarded to whom.
All I care about is finding the movies worth watching and worth talking about with my friends , friends who love movies more than they love the movie trophy parade.
The awards knickknacks are inconsequential to my love of what ends up on screen and the personal personalities of the moviemakers mean even less to me than the trophies.
I’m not sucking Kechiche’s dick; I’m just watching his movie. He’s not my friend. You are.
Shutter Island may have been financially successful but the movie itself was garbage. I hope Jupiter is actually a good movie.
“Frankly, I think they need to leave the comic book world and go back to small indie movies, like Bound.”
SallyinChicago, your wish is granted because the Wachowskis have NEVER made a comic book movie.
If you don’t care for movies like Cloud Atlas that’s your prerogative . But many of us adored it including Roger Ebert who gave it 4 stars. So please use you movie wishes to wish that studios would stop churning out formulaic junk instead of wishing that artist would stop making art. Just because you don’t like the art doesn’t mean it ceases to be art. And furthermore how very sad that it has to always come back to rhis: “was the movie a hit? No? Then what the fuck good is it? Hey Hollywood, you artsy numbskulls, stop making movies that aren’t hits!!”
Ugh. Gross.
Here’s frankly what I think. Frankly I think we should step back and let directors make whatever kinds of movies they want to make and stop worrying about whether any of the rich dudes at the top are getting any fucking richer.
Not “well” before Cannes. What am I talking about? But yeah, I know what you mean.
Well, I think it went up well before Cannes. I have watched a few interviews with Lea and Adele, and are always asked about the way the director treated them so badly. And they tend to defend him. Fair play.
‘Did you also notice how he did not give a fraction of a fuck about the dignity and credibility of his two actresses when grinding them to the bone during the shooting of Blue Is The Warmest Color.’
Did you also notice how both actresses’ credibility has shot up since winning the Palme d’Or?
‘Bravo to studios who still take chances on artists like this, and more power to them, in whatever marketing decisions they need to make in order for such lavish leeway to be financially feasible.’
Warner Bros., mostly.
I’m not entirely sold that this is a decision based solely on working on effects. It’s plain to see that Jupiter Ascending would have gotten slaughtered in its July slot. This reminds me of recent push-backs for G.I. Joe: Retaliation (they wanted to add more Channing Tatum) and 300: Rise of an Empire – both of which benefitted from opening outside of a more competitive summer season. That said, though this is probably a sage decision on Warner Bros.’ part, it’s also a decision they’ve made less than two months away from its initial prospective release date, and that doesn’t bode well.
I still think Jupiter Ascending will bomb, though just not to the same extent as it might have next month. And I still think it’ll be shit. But I’m willing to allow the Wachowskis to change my mind entirely when I see it next year.
“Notice how much Abdellatif Kechiche did not give a fraction of a fuck about qualifying for Oscar consideration for Blue Is the Warmest Color.”
Did you also notice how he did not give a fraction of a fuck about the dignity and credibility of his two actresses when grinding them to the bone during the shooting of Blue Is The Warmest Color.
😉
Kane, I wrote this editorialized news item, not Sasha.
I got my impression of the “internet’s” reaction from seeing the weird glee erupt on twitter upon hearing this announcement — and yes the acidic schadenfreude was thick and palpable coming from all those subsets of movie opinionators you mention: intellectuals, bloggers, self-proclaimed critics, readers and average Internet trolls.
Large segments of all those kinds of people are absolutely already writing off this movie as a disaster based on nothing but a trailer , and now this news that the release date will be delayed 6 months has many people ready to assume that it’s a fiasco.
That’s always the conclusion people want to jump to whenever a movie has a difficult birth. They see the slightest sign of labor pains and many people weirdly deduce that the baby must be deformed.
I just try to resist that rush to judgment, ok? I find it discouraging, even depressing to see so many people making wisecracks and smirking about a delicate and difficult $150 million artistic decision. So I was pissed about that when I wrote this and just felt like standing up against that kind of mentality.
Well let’s be truthful: The wachowskis haven’t had a hit movie since Matrix. Frankly, I think they need to leave the comic book world and go back to small indie movies, like Bound.
Mik, That’s how I feel. I’m just happily astonished that two wild visionaries are given repeated opportunities to spend $150 million dollars on movies that nobody nobody ever expects to conform to regulation “awards-worthy” boundaries or any other formulaic contraits. Bravo to studios who still take chances on artists like this, and more power to them, in whatever marketing decisions they need to make in order for such lavish leeway to be financially feasible. There’s plenty else to keep us busy this summer without trying to rush a difficult, ambitious and possibly fragile to theaters. Hard enough for unique movies to find their audience without being shoehorned in between more corporate branded forms of CGI monstronsities. Give them time to polish their passion project to high gloss and then give the film a premiere in a more quiet month when the steaming hot piranha season is past, yes?
I understand the comparison between Jupiter Rising and Gravity is tempting because both seek to be more than brainless blockbusters and both are directed by visual artists. But while I do agree that Gravity was a rare artful epic, I hope that Jupiter Ascending is something even more rare — an art-house epic.
Sasha, you really let the Internet get to you. Are these people who are saying “game over man!” intellectuals and bloggers, critics, dear readers of yours or other sites who know what they’re talking about? Or are they your average internet troll? If it’s the troll…nothing you say will sway them.
That said I’m not looking forward to this movie one bit. It doesn’t look appealing and a bit on par with Cloud Atlas in that it’ll be a noble failure.
I cant imagine for a second that this film is going to bother awards nominations, but I loved Cloud Atlas and I love Sean Bean…so regardless of whether they will ever reach the heights of The Matrix again, I personally am on board with the Wachowski’s making ‘interesting’ films, irrelevant of how finally successful or critically polarising they may or may not be.
[Nothing to do with awards narratives; I personally expect Jupiter relatively to be a fun ride as far as a mainstream movie could go and I’m all right with that thought]
If effects work was in fact only one main thing […], then to me, it should be viewed as a good thing in a sense – because it could also denote that the storyline, as well as everything else, was already good enough, thus presumably needing no correcting, for the Wachowski siblings, as well as the suits and all shakers involved in the project.
Despite Tatum and Kunis’ [sp] names […] to the project, I’m in mainly because of the Wachowski brother and sister, and — whether or not relevant to the modern-day Wachowski context — especially for what they had done with the Matrix project. I’m hoping, regardless of the release date, they (people involved, including the Wachowski siblings) did the right thing as far as a mainstream movie goes. (But then my “right thing” might not be the same with your “right thing”.)
(By the way, I agree to an extent with Caucasian worlds’ God’s son that Tatum wearing blond hair somehow does not sit well either. But I guess I would get used to it somewhere in Act IV.)
Channing Tatum and blonde hair = no.
I’d be glad to hear that additional special effects were needed to fix Channing Tatum’s hair and ears back to normal and to digitally remove all those shirts that some crazy costume person put on him.
Jupiter Ascending is not an Oscar movie. In no way shape or form. Why does it need to conform to awards narrative scheduling?
Notice how much Abdellatif Kechiche did not give a fraction of a fuck about qualifying for Oscar consideration for Blue Is the Warmest Color.
Anyone who thought Jupiter Ascending was going to be the first hardcore intergalactic science fiction film that the Academy didn’t scorn and piss on, please raise their hand. Who here was expecting Mila Kunis to get a Best Actress nomination for this movie? Anybody? Of course not.
This is exactly what people were saying about Shutter Island too — “Oh no, but now it will miss out on all the fancy Oscar invitation hoopla! Paramount must think it’s worthless!” And then Shutter Island became one of my favorite Scorsese films ever. Lo and behold, I can love a movie even if it doesn’t try to qualify for the Oscars.
I hear what you’re saying JamDenTel, but thank god everything in world cinema and and everything in Hollywood doesn’t revolve around “awards narratives.”
That means I won’t have to puke myself to death from Feb-Oct every year.
Channing Tatum and blonde hair = no.
From the trailers, I’m not drawn to the movie. I’d watch it though.
It being pushed is neither here or there for me.
Here’s the thing, though: Gravity got pushed from November to October, and that 6 months before its scheduled opening. And October isn’t anything to sneeze at, it’s definitely a good spot to release a film if you want it to build an awards narrative.
J.A. got pushed from the prime July spot to February (still not a great time of year), only 6 WEEKS beforehand.
I’m not saying it’s necessarily bad (though I was not all that impressed by the trailer), but I’m saying the studio has SERIOUS reservations about its potential. Yeah, maybe the VFX needed a little sprucing up, but a last-minute shift like this…that suggests other factors.